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PostPosted: Mon May 07, 2018 4:02 pm 
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Joined: Thu Dec 07, 2017 3:16 pm
Posts: 52
The group hearing happened last week Etienne, where all parents came, this was our appointment which was moved on their request. We assumed 30 min for our case and thought 10 min. Speech was very crisp from our side, we didn’t question the Head when he put across his points in a couple of min., Should we have asked something? We just focused on our case.

Felt very good thanks to all of your help over the last 2 months and to the point, but now a bit flustered, could we have done anything different?

The questions didn’t seem like filler questions at all, I sent all the evidences to appealbox, did they have any missing link in your opinion?

Next appeal this Friday, in case we can improve.


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PostPosted: Sat May 12, 2018 6:11 pm 
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Both appeals done. Heart felt gratitude to Etienne and all members so supportive of this hard and uncertain time for struggling parents.

Don’t have much hope now, as both the times felt very unpolished and weak but couldn’t have done this without your care and advice.

Big thank you all :!:


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PostPosted: Sat May 12, 2018 8:14 pm 
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Joined: Mon Dec 12, 2005 5:26 pm
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Quote:
The questions didn’t seem like filler questions at all
Probably no time for filler questions! Thank goodness they had a separate stage 1, but a 20 minute slot is still extremely tight for stage 2.
It might be sufficient where the only issue is oversubscription, but the problem with grammar school appeals is that there could be a number of issues to consider (e.g. an unsuccessful review, qualification and extenuating circumstances, as well as reasons for preference).

Quote:
Both appeals done.
Good luck!

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Etienne


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PostPosted: Fri May 18, 2018 4:40 pm 
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Joined: Thu Dec 07, 2017 3:16 pm
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Appeal 1 less important but felt went better - didn’t go through.

Immediate reflection- shouldn’t have tried for 2 as it diluted our effort and mind from the important appeal, which I am sure will not go through.

Remembering Anotherdad’s early Prediction here.

But this failure will only add to future grit.

Naive, unfocused and unpolished appeals have no chances even with Etienne’s brilliant effort to guide and rescue. Whole hearted thanks to you and all you who gave hard yet intense feedback.

Thanks.


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PostPosted: Fri May 18, 2018 5:35 pm 
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Joined: Mon Dec 12, 2005 5:26 pm
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Quote:
Immediate reflection- shouldn’t have tried for 2 as it diluted our effort and mind from the important appeal, which I am sure will not go through.
I think you have to appeal for as many schools as possible in order to maximise your chances. :)

Quote:
Remembering Anotherdad’s early Prediction here.
Anotherdad gave good advice.

And the Q&As are full of cautions such as:
      Quote:
      Realistically the odds are against most appeals succeeding ....... bear in mind that, no matter how good a case you may have, it is very unwise to go into an appeal expecting to win. Hope for the best, but be prepared for the worst.

Quote:
Naive, unfocused and unpolished .......
You worked extremely hard to assemble a good case.
All you had to do was read out the sections I highlighted, and the specimen summing up, and you had a focused and polished presentation! :)

Admittedly, the question & answer session can be tricky. You never quite know what the panel might ask.

Once we'd shortened it, your written case was also focused and polished, although I became a bit alarmed when you wanted to keep adding generic information to the appendices.

Quote:
Appeal 1 less important but felt went better - didn’t go through.
If you'd like to send a copy of the decision letter, I'd be happy to check to see if everything appears to be in order.

_________________
Etienne


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PostPosted: Tue May 22, 2018 1:16 pm 
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Joined: Thu Dec 07, 2017 3:16 pm
Posts: 52
It was all your support Etienne, so all my credit goes to you Moderator’s.
The first appeals decision is sent to the appeal box which appears to have been written falsely. It seems we misunderstood the strength of our case and evidences and the short and crisp hearing. Feel a bit cheated by this panel.
But life doesn’t end here, it will all work out in the end.

Thanks for your end to end support. My Ds got lot of blessings and support from you all through this case.


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PostPosted: Thu May 24, 2018 9:26 pm 
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Joined: Mon Dec 12, 2005 5:26 pm
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Hi Rsinsinwar

Although you've sent me the most important part of the letter ("The Decision"), I am unable to say whether the letter as a whole complies with the Appeals Code, because of the missing parts.
There are specific requirements with regard to how a panel must deal with stage one, but I cannot tell from what you've sent me whether or not the panel have fully complied.
I've not seen the "Parents' Evidence" section, but I assume you would have noticed if any of your key points had been overlooked.

I do think the panel have had proper regard to the Equality Act, and dealt correctly with disability.

I also think they have gone to more trouble than we would normally expect to try and explain their decision. It's much more detailed than usual, and suggests to me that they recognised you had a case worthy of careful consideration.

However, there are contradictions. For example, at one point the letter refers to "a number of strengths in terms of academic ability", and yet elsewhere the panel's overall judgement is "a boy of average strengths in terms of academic ability".

There appear to be other errors, which you have highlighted, such as "the primary school have not said if they are making adjustments for him in the SATs", when there was evidence provided stating that adjustments will be made.

You have nothing to lose by making a complaint to the ESFA along the lines "We do not dispute that the panel is entitled to make a judgement, but that judgement should not be based on contradictions and inaccuracies."
Scroll down to D25:
https://www.elevenplusexams.co.uk/appeals/ombudsman#d6

Whether or not a complaint succeeds rather depends on what is in the clerk's notes (the authoritative record of the hearing).
It's just possible that mistakes have crept into the decision letter, and that the letter is not an accurate reflection of the clerk's notes, so I would expect the ESFA to check whether the panel used the correct information in arriving at their decision.

Before making a complaint you could try and get access to the clerk's notes to see for yourself what they say, but I note that the last sentence of the decision letter discourages any further correspondence.
It is more likely than not that you would get hold of the notes eventually, but you might have to fight for them and it could take time.

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Etienne


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PostPosted: Mon Jun 04, 2018 12:01 pm 
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Joined: Thu Dec 07, 2017 3:16 pm
Posts: 52
Thanks Etienne for looking through the decision letter, I shall send you the remaining pages also in the appeal box.

Having worked so hard on the appeal I am very scared to enter another rabbit hole of complaint procedure and boy I am blown away by the procedure ;p

My question to you is that since some of my Ds's case developed in April as we discovered his painful and slow handwriting which may or may not have roots in his disease - any significant additional supportive evidence, say a Doctors review should be added as different circumstances since the appeal to the complaint to ESFA?
or just base the complaint on Clerk's notes /decision letter carrying contradictory and incorrect details?

Does anyone have had a success at re-hearing and can give insight?

thx


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PostPosted: Mon Jun 04, 2018 1:24 pm 
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I would have thought - but perhaps Etienne will confirm - that your letter to the ESFA is to complain about the decision perhaps having been made on inaccurate judgements and contradictions. The ESFA will not be interested in extra medical evidence - their role will be to determine if the panel used correct information in making their judgement.

Etienne pointed out that having read the letter, it appears to her that your case was carefully considered. If that was the case, it is more probable that the panel used accurate information in making their judgement and haven't recorded that accurately in the decision letter than it is that they used incorrect information in making the judgement.


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PostPosted: Tue Jun 05, 2018 1:25 pm 
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Joined: Sun Oct 22, 2017 6:44 pm
Posts: 16
I sympathise with u we are going through the same thing. The clerk is refusing to give us the notes so I have made a complaint through ICO to see if it is possible to get these notes. Our inaccuracies are about year 6 academic evidence, them saying expected standard when all sats mock results were high end greater depth - clerk confirmed this is what panel have sighted so not a mistake in decision letter. Not sure how long I can wait for ICO to investigate or whether I just pursue a complaint about appeals without seeing clerks notes. The injustice of this system is quite astounding


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