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 Post subject: Re: Supporting evidence
PostPosted: Fri Apr 27, 2018 7:19 pm 
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https://www.elevenplusexams.co.uk/appeals/general#a59

Sunshine1976 wrote:
do I include copies of the school prospectus, newsletters, curriculum, website etc to draw attention to certain reasons or can I just quote the source?
I think the source would be sufficient. After all, the school representative at the hearing would soon intervene if you were making it all up!
It is likely the panel would also appreciate being spared a mass of additional paperwork.

Of more importance would be evidence for why these things matter to your son.

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PostPosted: Fri May 18, 2018 7:55 pm 
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Hi, we had the first school hearing and were unfortunately not successful! We have one more in June. At our appeal the school ( he also sat the exam at this school) brought along my child’s exam scripts. They shared with the panel and I also briefly got to see them.

My questions are, is this right? Can the school introduce evidence in the room that wasn’t made available to all parties in advance to adequately consider?

Also, I know the scripts are not normally shared with parents. Would the second school be able to request the scripts from the first school? If so, would I get them in advance too?

Would be helpful to get any thoughts on anyone who has experience with this.

Thanks


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PostPosted: Fri May 18, 2018 9:19 pm 
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Quote:
Can the school introduce evidence in the room that wasn’t made available to all parties in advance to adequately consider?
As you realise, evidence must normally be seen by all parties in advance, but .....
      Quote:
      An appeal panel must decide whether any material not submitted by the specified deadline is to be considered, taking into account its significance and the effect of a possible need to adjourn the hearing.

It's not clear why the scripts were passed round.

I assume they weren't kept by the panel, but were returned to the school representative in your presence?

As you say, scripts are not normally shared with parents, and they are a specific exemption under the Data Protection Act.
Even if an admission authority is willing - at its discretion - to allow access to the scripts, I wouldn't expect parents to be given copies. For this reason I think any admission authority would want to avoid a situation where scripts would have to be included as part of the appeal paperwork.

In the case of your particular appeal I think it would have been better if the school representative had retained the scripts, and simply referred to them if there was a specific question that needed answering (e.g. "Did the candidate finish the paper?").

Have you any reason to think you were disadvantaged by what happened, and that it affected the outcome of the appeal?
Ultimately this is what really matters.

Quote:
Would the second school be able to request the scripts from the first school?
I cannot at the moment see any legitimate reason, so I don't think so.

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PostPosted: Fri May 18, 2018 9:50 pm 
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Thank you. I think disadvantaged is strong but I did feel that bringing the scripts out during the appeal was a bit unfair, in terms of all parties having proper time to review content. I had explained earlier that as a dyslexic there were aspects of the exam eg. creative writing and verbal reasoning that my son would find more challenging. As it turns out, he did better in the writing part than average students, so my argument was discredited. I explained that he spent more time on this part as he has slow writing speed, so needed to in order to get his ideas down. The lack of access arrangements meant he was robbing from another section to do this. It would have been better to all have had the same information. I’m more interested in preparing for the second appeal, but didn’t want to feel ambushed again.


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PostPosted: Fri May 18, 2018 9:57 pm 
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Sorry I forgot to mention, we also have the same appeals clerk for both school appeals. I presume, this is fine, as they are not part of the panel and would need to record what was actually discussed in each session.


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PostPosted: Fri May 18, 2018 11:03 pm 
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Quote:
we also have the same appeals clerk for both school appeals. I presume, this is fine
Yes, it is permitted.

It is not unknown to get the same panel member(s)!

Quote:
I think disadvantaged is strong but I did feel that bringing the scripts out during the appeal was a bit unfair, in terms of all parties having proper time to review content. I had explained earlier that as a dyslexic there were aspects of the exam eg. creative writing and verbal reasoning that my son would find more challenging. As it turns out, he did better in the writing part than average students, so my argument was discredited.

Although your main concern is the next appeal, you could consider making a complaint to the ombudsman (or to the ESFA if this is an academy) to see what they think about the matter.
https://www.elevenplusexams.co.uk/appeals/ombudsman
You've nothing to lose!
You will only get a re-hearing, though, if they conclude that the outcome of the appeal was affected.
(The wording of the decision letter ought to tell you on what basis the appeal failed.)

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PostPosted: Sun Jun 03, 2018 4:18 pm 
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Hi there, this might sound strange but if you are no longer going to use an argument/ some evidence in your appeal, can you "withdraw" it? I know you can add evidence but I wasn't sure about the reverse? Or do you just state at the start of the hearing, sorry to have wasted your time, but I will no longer be referring to appendix x? Or is it best to just not mention it all during the presentation?


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PostPosted: Sun Jun 03, 2018 4:41 pm 
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Sunshine1976 wrote:
Or do you just state at the start of the hearing, sorry to have wasted your time, but I will no longer be referring to appendix x?
Probably best to do that and be upfront.

If you just ignore it, it will either prompt questions from the panel ("Have you forgotten to tell us about .....?"), or, when they take their decisions, they might be wasting their time considering something that you no longer wish to be part of your case.

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PostPosted: Sun Jun 03, 2018 5:09 pm 
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Just say something like, 'with regard to document x, we have decided that we no longer want this to be considered as part of our case'. Might be nice to say briefly why (or is it something that the panel may have worked out for themselves anyway?).

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PostPosted: Sun Jun 03, 2018 8:09 pm 
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Thanks both. It’s regarding age standardisation, whereby at the SHSB panel they said it can’t be taken into account as it wasn’t part of the current admission criteria. It wasn’t my main point, which was on academic evidence and the late diagnosis of dyslexia. However the age one was discussed and was then specifically mentioned in the rejection letter.

I do personally think being an August child, this is relevant but don’t want this to derail my other more relevant points. So struggling with to leave it out completely or mention it high level and risk being questioned and a derailment!

I know it’s the same appeal clerk for both but the WHSB panel hasn’t been informed yet.


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